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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47457
10/22/05 07:15 AM
10/22/05 07:15 AM
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Active Member 2011
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Joined: May 2002
Posts: 3,965
Sweden
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I havent read trough all of this thread and therefore you may already have covered this ground. I am just thinking that a strong answere to this thread question ought to be found in your respective personal experience. Do you daily experience a genuine conversion or do you not? The exception on a personal level could be that you do not experience it but believe the Spirit is telling you you ought to do so, which would be a good third option.
/Thomas
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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47458
10/23/05 02:01 AM
10/23/05 02:01 AM
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SDA
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quote:
That's not language I'm most comfortable with because I find "connection" to be a bit vague, but I agree with the idea.
Do you agree that Sister White used it often?
Also, I agree with you that it is faith that enables us to stay connected to Jesus. I believe faith and a vital connection together enable us to imitate the example of Jesus.
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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47459
10/23/05 02:05 AM
10/23/05 02:05 AM
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Thomas, since I believe daily conversion means choosing to maintain a vital connection to Jesus on a daily, moment by moment, basis - then, yes, I choose to stay converted every day. However, I cannot say that I maintain a vital connection every moment of every day. Sometimes I allow it to slip and I find myself repenting again.
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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47460
10/23/05 07:10 AM
10/23/05 07:10 AM
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Active Member 2011
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So the answere to the thread question is yes. ![[Smile]](images/icons/smile.gif) /Thomas
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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47461
10/23/05 02:56 PM
10/23/05 02:56 PM
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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47462
10/23/05 06:27 PM
10/23/05 06:27 PM
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Active Member 2012
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Lawrence, Kansas
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Is conversion only related to sin? That is, is the only time is converted when one sins, becomes aware of that sin, and repents?
Is it possible to become converted by an appreciation of the love of God revealed in Jesus Christ, irrespective of having sinned?
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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47463
10/23/05 06:31 PM
10/23/05 06:31 PM
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Active Member 2012
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Lawrence, Kansas
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Regarding "connection", what does "connection" add that faith doesn't already provide? Can you have genuine Biblical faith and not be "connected"? Should Jesus have said, "that whosoever believeth in Him, and also forms a connection to God, should not perish but have everlasting life"? Is faith alone (i.e. genuine Biblical faith) sufficient for salvation? Or is something else needed (like forming a connection) How does one form a connection with God, if not by faith?
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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47464
10/23/05 06:45 PM
10/23/05 06:45 PM
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Active Member 2011
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How I view a connection with God is best described by this verse quote:
Romans 8:9
You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.
If the Holy Spirit resides in a person there is an undeniable connection between that person and God. If the Holy Spirit does not live within a person, well, the scripture is clear enough about that.
What causes the Holy Spirit to pack up and move out from a christian He once lived in?
/Thomas
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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47465
10/24/05 12:54 AM
10/24/05 12:54 AM
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quote:
Is conversion only related to sin? That is, is the only time is converted when one sins, becomes aware of that sin, and repents?
Initially, it involves dying to sin, crucifying our old man habits of sin. But dying daily, being converted daily, involves maintaining faith in Jesus, maturing in the fruits of the Spirit.
quote:
Is it possible to become converted by an appreciation of the love of God revealed in Jesus Christ, irrespective of having sinned?
Theoretically, yes, but in reality "all have sinned." So, it involves all of the above.
SC 27
It is true that men sometimes become ashamed of their sinful ways, and give up some of their evil habits, before they are conscious that they are being drawn to Christ. But whenever they make an effort to reform, from a sincere desire to do right, it is the power of Christ that is drawing them. An influence of which they are unconscious works upon the soul, and the conscience is quickened, and the outward life is amended. And as Christ draws them to look upon His cross, to behold Him whom their sins have pierced, the commandment comes home to the conscience. The wickedness of their life, the deep-seated sin of the soul, is revealed to them. They begin to comprehend something of the righteousness of Christ, and exclaim, "What is sin, that it should require such a sacrifice for the redemption of its victim? Was all this love, all this suffering, all this humiliation, demanded, that we might not perish, but have everlasting life?" {SC 27.1}
quote:
How does one form a connection with God, if not by faith?
Correct. It is faith that enables us to establish and maintain a vital connection to Jesus.
John
15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
15:5 I am the vine, ye [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast [them] into the fire, and they are burned.
15:7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
15:8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.
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Re: Is Genuine Conversion A Daily Experience?
#47466
10/24/05 01:17 AM
10/24/05 01:17 AM
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quote:
What causes the Holy Spirit to pack up and move out from a christian He once lived in?
Choosing to sin deliberately, intentionally. The Holy Spirit cannot occupy a divided throne (heart).
Matthew
6:24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.
2 Peter
2:20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
2:21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known [it], to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
2:22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog [is] turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.
Hebrews
10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
5T 393
Said our Saviour: "Ye shall know them by their fruits." And again: "He that is not with Me is against Me." There is no neutral ground between those who work to the utmost of their ability for Christ and those who work for the adversary of souls. {5T 393.3}
TMK 63
God will not occupy a divided heart or reign from a divided throne. Every rival that holds the affections and diverts them from the God of love must be dethroned. The Lord demands all that there is of us, and there must be no reserve. {TMK 63.3}
FE 502
God would have us learn the solemn lesson that we are working out our own destiny. The characters we form in this life decide whether or not we are fitted to live through the eternal ages. No man can with safety attempt to serve both God and Mammon. God is fully able to keep us in the world, but not of the world. His love is not uncertain and fluctuating. Ever He watches over His children with a care that is measureless and everlasting. But He requires us to give Him our undivided allegiance. "No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and Mammon." {FE 502.1}
2T 442, 443
Very many who profess to be servants of Christ are none of His. They are deceiving their souls to their own destruction. While they profess to be servants of Christ, they are not living in obedience to His will. "Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?" Many, while professing to be servants of Christ, are obeying another master, working daily against the Master whom they profess to serve. "No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon." {2T 442.1}
Earthly and selfish interests engage the soul, mind, and strength of God's professed followers. To all intents and purposes they are servants of mammon. They have not experienced a crucifixion to the world, with its affections and lusts. But few among the many who profess to be Christ's followers can say in the language of the apostle: "God forbid that I should glory, save in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified unto me, and I unto the world." "I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave Himself for me." If willing obedience and true love characterize the lives of the people of God, their light will shine with a holy brightness to the world. {2T 442.2}
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