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Re: Are we transgressing the 1st commandment or not?
#77503
08/31/06 09:03 PM
08/31/06 09:03 PM
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Active Member 2012
14500+ Member
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Are we transgressing the 1st commandment or not?
#77505
08/31/06 10:21 PM
08/31/06 10:21 PM
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Active Member 2012
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 14,795
Lawrence, Kansas
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I think the important thing is to understand God's character. The purpose of Jesus' mission was to show us what God is like. This is what we need to know.
I think there are more important issues than this one (i.e. the trinity) insofar as being mixed up about God's character is concerned. In particular, picturing God as one who would set someone on fire for acting contrary to His wishes, or as one who needs to be appeased by blood before He will forgive are more important issues. It appears to me that you and I see God's character very similarly.
I guess one thing that's important to me is to be in agreement with what I perceive to be inspired statements from God, which for me includes Ellen White's writings.
I guess there are some issues which are vitally important to some people which to me just aren't. Maybe my opinion on this will change at some point.
Anyway, to repeat, I think the vitally important thing is to understand God's character.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Are we transgressing the 1st commandment or not?
#77506
09/01/06 02:26 AM
09/01/06 02:26 AM
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OP
Charter Member
Active Member 2012
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,157
Jakarta, Indonesia
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For me:
The Father is the Almighty God, the great Source of life and all things, for Whom we live. The Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God whom through Him all things were created and live.
This is self explanatory.
The 1st command says:
“I am the Lord, your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.”
This is also self explanatory, Christ said that He is the Lord (which agrees with 1 Cor. 8:6) our God. This is said then, that Christ our Lord is God.
Now we have the Father as God Almighty, we have Christ, the Lord our God. Both are God, but One is the great Source of life and all things, for Whom we live, and the other One is our Mediator in Whom we live.
How about the Holy Spirit?
He is the Spirit of the Almighty God, but I never read or hear that He has a name and personification. Do we live face to face with the Holy Spirit in heaven and the new earth, or would he reside in the Father and hidden?
When Christ said: “You shall have no other gods before me,” I think he didn’t want the Jews to have idols and bow and worship it as their god, because there wee many gods in the time of the Jews that belongs to other nations and tribes around them. I think this statement exclude God the Father.
So, Christ is the Lord in whom we live, our God and Mediator to the Father, the Almighty God for whom we live. Clear!
In His love
James S
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Re: Are we transgressing the 1st commandment or not?
#77507
09/01/06 10:35 AM
09/01/06 10:35 AM
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Full Member
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 149
USA
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Quote:
For me:
The Father is the Almighty God, the great Source of life and all things, for Whom we live. The Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the only begotten Son of God whom through Him all things were created and live.
This is self explanatory.
The 1st command says:
“I am the Lord, your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery.”
This is also self explanatory, Christ said that He is the Lord (which agrees with 1 Cor. 8:6) our God. This is said then, that Christ our Lord is God.
Now we have the Father as God Almighty, we have Christ, the Lord our God. Both are God, but One is the great Source of life and all things, for Whom we live, and the other One is our Mediator in Whom we live.
How about the Holy Spirit?
He is the Spirit of the Almighty God, but I never read or hear that He has a name and personification. Do we live face to face with the Holy Spirit in heaven and the new earth, or would he reside in the Father and hidden?
When Christ said: “You shall have no other gods before me,” I think he didn’t want the Jews to have idols and bow and worship it as their god, because there wee many gods in the time of the Jews that belongs to other nations and tribes around them. I think this statement exclude God the Father.
So, Christ is the Lord in whom we live, our God and Mediator to the Father, the Almighty God for whom we live. Clear!
In His love
James S
Worded prefectly, I like it
Peace and Grace
David
The greatest want of the world is the want of men-- men who will not be bought or sold, men who in their inmost souls are true and honest, men who do not fear to call sin by its right name, men whose conscience is as true to duty as the needle to the pole, men who will stand for the right though the heavens fall.
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Re: Are we transgressing the 1st commandment or not?
#77508
09/02/06 08:27 PM
09/02/06 08:27 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2020
4500+ Member
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,583
USA
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I haven't followed this thread, but is this what you're mainly questioning James - whether the Holy Spirit should be worshipped as God? Quote:
How about the Holy Spirit?
He is the Spirit of the Almighty God, but I never read or hear that He has a name and personification. Do we live face to face with the Holy Spirit in heaven and the new earth, or would he reside in the Father and hidden?
When Christ said: “You shall have no other gods before me,” I think he didn’t want the Jews to have idols and bow and worship it as their god, because there wee many gods in the time of the Jews that belongs to other nations and tribes around them. I think this statement exclude God the Father.
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Re: Are we transgressing the 1st commandment or not?
#77509
09/02/06 09:18 PM
09/02/06 09:18 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Quote:
However, it is not another person; the person of the spirit is the Father. It is the Father's spirit.
How should this verse be interpreted?
"Baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the [presence of the Father? presence of the Son? presence of both?]"
Should we be baptized in the name of a Person and also in the name of the presence of that Person? Or should we be baptized in the name of a Person and in the name of that same Person again? That is, in the name of the Father and of the Son, and of the (Father and the Son)? Does this make any sense?
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Re: Are we transgressing the 1st commandment or not?
#77510
09/02/06 09:26 PM
09/02/06 09:26 PM
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5500+ Member
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Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,154
Brazil
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Quote:
So, Christ is the Lord in whom we live, our God and Mediator to the Father, the Almighty God for whom we live.
Since Christ is called God, James, should we worship a lesser god and a higher God? Or a God more powerful and a God less powerful? This is bitheism, not monotheism.
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Re: Are we transgressing the 1st commandment or not?
#77511
09/02/06 10:50 PM
09/02/06 10:50 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2020
4500+ Member
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,583
USA
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James, if you've read some of my statements on the nature of the Godhead on other threads you'll see that like you, I'm not comfortable with using the term 'trinity' and neither was Ellen White. She did not use that term even once in all her thousands of pages of writings. But, I also believe that all three members of the Godhead are God. So I agree with the last two posts by Rosangela.
You all already know this but by way of reminder, we only know as much as scripture reveals about God. Scripture can't possibly reveal Infinity to us. We know some important things about God. We know the essentials. There is an infinity beyond that that we don't know.
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Re: Are we transgressing the 1st commandment or not?
#77512
09/02/06 11:02 PM
09/02/06 11:02 PM
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SDA
Charter Member
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 4,583
USA
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The reason I think it is important to allow all three members of the Godhead to be God is that it gives us a better understanding of the heavenly fellowship which is the universal ideal of social interaction and fellowship. In the counsels of God we have a glimps into the noble interactions of the Three. Each has His distinct identity and role but perfect, unbroken, eternal harmony and unselfish love has always reigned supreme between them. The best picture we have on earth of this heavenly society is that unity of sanctified, tender yet intense love between a man and a woman. The most unselfish and intense romance is a small reflection of this great reality.
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