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Re: What if Jesus had failed?
[Re: Mountain Man]
#87057
03/27/07 05:49 PM
03/27/07 05:49 PM
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Active Member 2012
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The response of the saved is in relation to the success of Jesus on the cross - not to the hypothetical "risk". In the context of the quote, it's neither of these that the redeemed respond to: Never can the cost of our redemption be realized until the redeemed shall stand with the Redeemer before the throne of God. Then as the glories of the eternal home burst upon our enraptured senses we shall remember that Jesus left all this for us, that He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss. Then we shall cast our crowns at His feet, and raise the song, "Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honor, and glory, and blessing." Rev. 5:12. The redeemed respond to this: we shall remember that Jesus left all this for us, that He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss. It is not "hypothetical" risk that the redeemed respond to, but the actual risk Christ undertook. Really, how could she have articulated the idea any more clearly?
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: What if Jesus had failed?
[Re: Tom]
#87058
03/27/07 05:51 PM
03/27/07 05:51 PM
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How does this all play out in the prophetic utterance of Genesis 3:15 that was uttered by God Himself?
Quote:
Gen. 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
Was this also an uncertain prophecy in relation to the risk factor?
Well, first off let me state that I do not believe Ellen White's statement that God sent His Son at the risk of failure and eternal loss contradict Gen. 3:15. Assuming this to be the case, whatever interpretation we make of Gen. 3:15 should agree with that. Do you agree? Assuming the answer is yes, the simple conclusion is that Gen. 3:15 should be interpreted in a way that allows for risk, right? Or do you see some other alternative?
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: What if Jesus had failed?
[Re: Tom]
#87059
03/27/07 05:54 PM
03/27/07 05:54 PM
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Nowhere in the Bible is the idea of risk implied. This isn't true. The following 367 page book discusses this in detail. http://www.amazon.com/God-Who-Risks-Theology-Providence/dp/0830815015There are many examples of God's risking which could be given. Simply the fact that created Lucifer and man is indication of such.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Jesus took the risk of failure and eternal loss
[Re: Mountain Man]
#87060
03/27/07 06:00 PM
03/27/07 06:00 PM
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Risk is present throughout Scripture. There is absolutely nothing in the following quotes which suggest "hyperbole." Satan in heaven had hated Christ for His position in the courts of God. He hated Him the more when he himself was dethroned. He hated Him who pledged Himself to redeem a race of sinners. Yet into the world where Satan claimed dominion God permitted His Son to come, a helpless babe, subject to the weakness of humanity. He permitted Him to meet life's peril in common with every human soul, to fight the battle as every child of humanity must fight it, at the risk of failure and eternal loss. The heart of the human father yearns over his son. He looks into the face of his little child, and trembles at the thought of life's peril. He longs to shield his dear one from Satan's power, to hold him back from temptation and conflict. To meet a bitterer conflict and a more fearful risk, God gave His only-begotten Son, that the path of life might be made sure for our little ones. "Herein is love." Wonder, O heavens! and be astonished, O earth! (DA 49) Never can the cost of our redemption be realized until the redeemed shall stand with the Redeemer before the throne of God. Then as the glories of the eternal home burst upon our enraptured senses we shall remember that Jesus left all this for us, that He not only became an exile from the heavenly courts, but for us took the risk of failure and eternal loss. Then we shall cast our crowns at His feet, and raise the song, "Worthy is the Lamb that was slain to receive power, and riches, and wisdom, and strength, and honor, and glory, and blessing." Rev. 5:12. (DA 131)
The value of a soul, who can estimate? Would you know its worth, go to Gethsemane, and there watch with Christ through those hours of anguish, when He sweat as it were great drops of blood. Look upon the Saviour uplifted on the cross. Hear that despairing cry, "My God, My God, why hast Thou forsaken Me?" Mark 15:34. Look upon the wounded head, the pierced side, the marred feet. Remember that Christ risked all. For our redemption, heaven itself was imperiled. At the foot of the cross, remembering that for one sinner Christ would have laid down His life, you may estimate the value of a soul. (COL 196)
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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Re: Jesus took the risk of failure and eternal loss
[Re: Darius]
#87223
03/29/07 06:15 PM
03/29/07 06:15 PM
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I do find it interesting though that even though EGW uses the word "risk", I do not see such a word or thought expressed in the Sciptures, therefore, seeing that we ae to harmonize the writings of EGW with the Sciptures, we had better take another look at what the word "risk" really means in her writings. The concept of risk is abundant in Scripture. It's definitely not something Ellen White made up. What she meant by "risk of failure and eternal loss" and "all heaven was imperiled" is simple enough for a child to understand. What "risk" really means in her writings is just what "risk" always means: the possibility of loss. Just take a look at how she uses it in other writings. Similarly, "imperiled" means just what it always means: in danger. There is a prospect before us of a continued struggle at the risk of imprisonment, loss of property, and even of life itself, to defend the law of God, which is made void by the laws of men.--Testimonies, vol. 5, p. 712. With what relief does he hear in the distance its first faint cry! Following the sound, he climbs the steepest heights; he goes to the very edge of the precipice, at the risk of his own life. Thus he searches, while the cry, growing fainter, tells him that his sheep is ready to die. (GW 182) There is a prospect before us of a continued struggle, at the risk of imprisonment, loss of property and even of life itself, to defend the law of God.--5T 712 Here are some examples of her use of the word "risk." Really, there's nothing mysterious about it! I'm sure you understand what the word "risk" means.
Those who wait for the Bridegroom's coming are to say to the people, "Behold your God." The last rays of merciful light, the last message of mercy to be given to the world, is a revelation of His character of love.
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