HOME CHAT ROOM #1 CHAT ROOM #2 Forum Topics Within The Last 7 Days REGISTER ENTER FORUMS BIBLE SCHOOL CONTACT US

Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine Christian Family Fellowship Forums
(formerly Maritime SDA OnLine)
Consisting mainly of both members and friends of the Seventh-day Adventist Church
Welcomes and invites other members and friends of the Seventh-day Adventist Church to join us!

Click Here To Read Legal Notice & Disclaimer
Suggested a One Time Yearly $20 or Higher Donation Accepted Here to Help Cover the Yearly Expenses of Operating & Upgrading. We need at least $20 X 10 yearly donations.
Donations accepted: Here
ShoutChat Box
Newest Members
Ike, Andrew, Trainor, ekoorb1030, jibb555
1326 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums118
Topics9,232
Posts196,215
Members1,326
Most Online5,850
Feb 29th, 2020
Seventh-day Adventist Church In Canada Links
Seventh-day Adventist Church in Canada

Newfoundland & Labrador Mission

Maritime Conference

Quebec Conference

Ontario Conference

Manitoba-Saskatchewan Conference

Alberta Conference

British Columbia Conference

7 Top Posters(30 Days)
asygo 29
Rick H 24
kland 16
November
S M T W T F S
1 2
3 4 5 6 7 8 9
10 11 12 13 14 15 16
17 18 19 20 21 22 23
24 25 26 27 28 29 30
Member Spotlight
asygo
asygo
California, USA
Posts: 5,636
Joined: February 2006
Show All Member Profiles 
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
Live Space Station Tracking
Here is a link to show exactly where the Space Station is over earth right now: Click Here
Last 7 Pictures From Photo Gallery Forums
He hath set an harvest for thee
Rivers Of Living Water
He Leads Us To Green Pastures
Remember What God Has Done
Remember The Sabbath
"...whiter than snow..."
A Beautiful Spring Day
Who's Online
7 registered members (Karen Y, dedication, Daryl, daylily, TheophilusOne, 2 invisible), 2,482 guests, and 13 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 2 of 16 1 2 3 4 15 16
Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: Tom] #95067
01/29/08 11:31 PM
01/29/08 11:31 PM
Daryl  Online Canadian

Site Administrator
23000+ Member
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 25,132
Nova Scotia, Canada


In His Love, Mercy & Grace,

Daryl smile

John 8:32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

http://www.christians-discuss.com/forum/index.php
Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: Rick H] #95072
01/30/08 03:10 AM
01/30/08 03:10 AM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,636
California, USA
 Originally Posted By: Richard
How do you then see Romans 6...

I see a clear promise of victory over sin, but not a promise of lack of desire to sin.


By God's grace,
Arnold

1 John 5:11-13
And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life.
Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: asygo] #95077
01/30/08 02:37 PM
01/30/08 02:37 PM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
3000+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,245
Florida, USA
Paul continues on this same line of thought and in Romans 8 makes it even clearer what the Spirit does...

Life Through the Spirit
1Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus,[a] 2because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death. 3For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature,[b] God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering.[c] And so he condemned sin in sinful man,[d] 4in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit.
5Those who live according to the sinful nature have their minds set on what that nature desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6The mind of sinful man[e] is death, but the mind controlled by the Spirit is life and peace; 7the sinful mind[f] is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so. 8Those controlled by the sinful nature cannot please God.

9You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ. 10But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness. 11And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you.

12Therefore, brothers, we have an obligation—but it is not to the sinful nature, to live according to it. 13For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live, 14because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.
Romans 8:1-14

Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: Rick H] #95080
01/30/08 03:12 PM
01/30/08 03:12 PM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,636
California, USA
 Originally Posted By: Richard
Paul continues on this same line of thought and in Romans 8 makes it even clearer what the Spirit does...

Again, it is a clear promise of victory over sin, but no promise of the eradication of the desire to sin.

Consider the constant call to walk in the Spirit, and forsake the flesh. That would not be necessary if the desire to walk in the flesh was gone. As Paul said in Galatians, the flesh and the Spirit are always pulling against each other. Here, he tells us the same promise we find in Galatians - that if we walk in the Spirit, we will put to death the deeds of the flesh.

But even while walking in the Spirit, the flesh constantly calls for gratification. So he tells us in Romans 13:14, "But put on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the flesh, to fulfill its lusts."


By God's grace,
Arnold

1 John 5:11-13
And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life.
Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: asygo] #95084
01/31/08 12:51 PM
01/31/08 12:51 PM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
3000+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,245
Florida, USA
Then how, my brother would you read this verse, as how would we be able to live for righteousness if we did not first die to sins.

22"He committed no sin,
and no deceit was found in his mouth."[e] 23When they hurled their insults at him, he did not retaliate; when he suffered, he made no threats. Instead, he entrusted himself to him who judges justly. 24He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, so that we might die to sins and live for righteousness; by his wounds you have been healed. 1 Peter 2:22-24

As Always Your Brother in Christ
Rick

Last edited by Richard; 01/31/08 12:53 PM.
Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: Rick H] #95090
01/31/08 03:17 PM
01/31/08 03:17 PM
asygo  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2023

5500+ Member
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 5,636
California, USA
 Originally Posted By: Richard
Then how, my brother would you read this verse, as how would we be able to live for righteousness if we did not first die to sins.... 1 Peter 2:22-24

We cannot live for righteousness unless we die to sin. But dying to sin does not necessarily mean that we completely lose the desire to sin. When temptation comes, the flesh and Spirit will lust against each other, pulling us in different directions. We must then use our wills - the power of choice - to decide which call we will answer. Since we are to reckon ourselves dead to sin, we must not respond to the flesh - we don't speak to the dead. This is a daily, even moment by moment exercise.

That being said, there's this to think about:
 Quote:
All true obedience comes from the heart. It was heart work with Christ. And if we consent, He will so identify Himself with our thoughts and aims, so blend our hearts and minds into conformity to His will, that when obeying Him we shall be but carrying out our own impulses. The will, refined and sanctified, will find its highest delight in doing His service. When we know God as it is our privilege to know Him, our life will be a life of continual obedience. Through an appreciation of the character of Christ, through communion with God, sin will become hateful to us. {DA 668.3}


By God's grace,
Arnold

1 John 5:11-13
And this is the testimony, that God gave us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life.
Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: asygo] #95280
02/05/08 04:04 PM
02/05/08 04:04 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019

20000+ Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
I agree that born again believers, who are actively and aggressively abiding in Jesus and walking in the Spirit and mind of the new man, will not have a desire to sin. However, their fallen flesh nature will continue to tempt them from within to sin. Sinful flesh will always desire us to sin. But in Christ, and like Christ, we will recognize and resist the unholy clamorings of our fallen flesh nature. Such fallenness does not contaminate character.

Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: Mountain Man] #135429
07/28/11 01:11 PM
07/28/11 01:11 PM
Rick H  Offline
OP
Group: Admin Team
3000+ Member
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,245
Florida, USA
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
I agree that born again believers, who are actively and aggressively abiding in Jesus and walking in the Spirit and mind of the new man, will not have a desire to sin. However, their fallen flesh nature will continue to tempt them from within to sin. Sinful flesh will always desire us to sin. But in Christ, and like Christ, we will recognize and resist the unholy clamorings of our fallen flesh nature. Such fallenness does not contaminate character.
Would you consider that to be a plane of sinless perfection were like Enoch, God could take you or just being on a level of Job, a just and upright man?

Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: Rick H] #135435
07/29/11 02:13 PM
07/29/11 02:13 PM
Mountain Man  Offline
SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019

20000+ Member
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
Yes, the newborn believers Peter describes in the following passage are safe to translate alive.

1 Peter
2:1 Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings,
2:2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:
2:3 If so be ye have tasted that the Lord [is] gracious.

It doesn't require years of time on station as Christians to qualify for translation. Ellen wrote:

One ray of the glory of God, one gleam of the purity of Christ, penetrating the soul, makes every spot of defilement painfully distinct, and lays bare the deformity and defects of the human character. It makes apparent the unhallowed desires, the infidelity of the heart, the impurity of the lips. The sinner's acts of disloyalty in making void the law of God, are exposed to his sight, and his spirit is stricken and afflicted under the searching influence of the Spirit of God. He loathes himself as he views the pure, spotless character of Christ. {SC 29.1}

Such people are safe to save as is. They can spend the rest of eternity in heaven maturing in the fruits of the Spirit.

Re: The belief of "Sinless Perfection" ... [Re: Mountain Man] #135458
07/30/11 01:27 PM
07/30/11 01:27 PM
Green Cochoa  Offline
SDA
Active Member 2021

5500+ Member
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 7,003
The Orient
Originally Posted By: Mountain Man
Yes, the newborn believers Peter describes in the following passage are safe to translate alive.

1 Peter
2:1 Wherefore laying aside all malice, and all guile, and hypocrisies, and envies, and all evil speakings,
2:2 As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:
2:3 If so be ye have tasted that the Lord [is] gracious.

It doesn't require years of time on station as Christians to qualify for translation. Ellen wrote:

One ray of the glory of God, one gleam of the purity of Christ, penetrating the soul, makes every spot of defilement painfully distinct, and lays bare the deformity and defects of the human character. It makes apparent the unhallowed desires, the infidelity of the heart, the impurity of the lips. The sinner's acts of disloyalty in making void the law of God, are exposed to his sight, and his spirit is stricken and afflicted under the searching influence of the Spirit of God. He loathes himself as he views the pure, spotless character of Christ. {SC 29.1}

Such people are safe to save as is. They can spend the rest of eternity in heaven maturing in the fruits of the Spirit.

Where in that statement, Mike, did you see Mrs. White speaking of the saved? I see her speaking of the sinner. Sinners are not all saved.

Do you think it is enough for the sinner to "loath himself?"

Blessings,

Green Cochoa.


We can receive of heaven's light only as we are willing to be emptied of self. We can discern the character of God, and accept Christ by faith, only as we consent to the bringing into captivity of every thought to the obedience of Christ. And to all who do this, the Holy Spirit is given without measure. In Christ "dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in Him." [Colossians 2:9, 10.] {GW 57.1} -- Ellen White.
Page 2 of 16 1 2 3 4 15 16

Moderator  dedication, Rick H 

Sabbath School Lesson Study Material Link
Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
Most Recent Posts From Selected Public Forums
What are the seven kings of Rev. 17:10?
by dedication. 11/24/24 09:57 PM
No mail in Canada?
by Rick H. 11/22/24 06:45 PM
Seven Trumpets reconsidered
by Karen Y. 11/21/24 11:03 AM
Fourth quarter, 2024, The Gospel of John
by asygo. 11/20/24 02:31 AM
The 2024 Election, the Hegelian Dialectic
by ProdigalOne. 11/15/24 08:26 PM
"The Lord's Day" and Ignatius
by dedication. 11/15/24 02:19 AM
The Doctrine of the Nicolaitans
by dedication. 11/14/24 04:00 PM
Will Trump be able to lead..
by dedication. 11/13/24 07:13 PM
Is Lying Ever Permitted?
by kland. 11/13/24 05:04 PM
Global Warming Farce
by kland. 11/13/24 04:06 PM
Profiles Of Jesus In Zecharia
by dedication. 11/13/24 02:23 AM
Good and Evil of Higher Critical Bible Study
by dedication. 11/12/24 07:31 PM
The Great White Throne
by dedication. 11/12/24 06:39 PM
A god whom his fathers knew not..
by TruthinTypes. 11/05/24 12:19 AM
Most Recent Posts From Selected Private Forums of MSDAOL
Perils of the Emerging Church Movement
by dedication. 11/24/24 04:13 AM
Dr Ben Carson: Church and State
by Rick H. 11/22/24 07:12 PM
Will Trump Pass The Sunday Law?
by dedication. 11/22/24 12:51 PM
Understanding the 1,260-year Prophecy
by dedication. 11/22/24 12:35 PM
Private Schools
by Rick H. 11/22/24 07:54 AM
The Church is Suing the State of Maryland
by Rick H. 11/16/24 04:43 PM
Has the Catholic Church Changed?
by TheophilusOne. 11/16/24 08:53 AM
Dr Conrad Vine Banned
by Rick H. 11/15/24 06:11 AM
Understanding the 1290 & 1335 of Daniel 12?
by dedication. 11/05/24 03:16 PM
Forum Announcements
Visitors by Country Since February 11, 2013
Flag Counter
Google Maritime SDA OnLine Public Forums Site Search & Google Translation Service
Google
 
Web www.maritime-sda-online.com

Copyright 2000-Present
Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine (formerly Maritime SDA OnLine).

LEGAL NOTICE:
The views expressed in this forum are those of individuals
and do not necessarily represent those of Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine,
as well as the Seventh-day Adventist Church
from the local church level to the General Conference level.

Maritime 2nd Advent Believers OnLine (formerly Maritime SDA OnLine) is also a self-supporting ministry
and is not part of, or affiliated with, or endorsed by
The General Conference of Seventh-day Adventists headquartered in Silver Spring, Maryland
or any of its subsidiaries.

"And He saith unto them, follow Me, and I will make you fishers of men." Matt. 4:19
MARITIME 2ND ADVENT BELIEVERS ONLINE (FORMERLY MARITIME SDA ONLINE) CONSISTING MAINLY OF BOTH MEMBERS & FRIENDS
OF THE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH,
INVITES OTHER MEMBERS & FRIENDS OF THE SEVENTH-DAY ADVENTIST CHURCH ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD WHO WISHES TO JOIN US!
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1