DA quote again:



This is how Enoch and Moses and Elijah made it to heaven. God revealed His character and love to them through Christ as well as He has done to us.

Regarding the angels, they had doubts which were no removed until Christ's death on the cross (see "It Is Finished" in "The Desire of Ages," also you could search in EGW's writings for statements speaking of how the cross secured the universe).

Surely the angels were just as content to serve God as were Enoch, Moses, and Elijah, who believed before Jesus' revelation.

I wrote:



I explained why this was necessary.

And yet holy angels, as well as unfallen worlds, along with Enoch, Moses, and Elijah were content to serve God forever before Jesus' incarnation, before His revelation of God's character. How do you explain these facts? Don't they indicate these beings were already convinced God is forever worthy of their praise and worship? What more was needed to secure their love and devotion and obedience?

good morning brther,no the law can't save you but without law you can't be save because only through the law you know that you sin.read romans,2:1-29 thank you do have a blessed day.

Tom, how do you explain it?

MM, I wrote:



To which you responded:



Does this mean you disagree with my statement that "this revelation was necessary for man, unfallen worlds, and holy angels."

Please be more clear in your responses. In another thread I commented that Christ in revealed in all Scripture, and you wrote a response which indicated that you disagreed with this assertion, then later explained that you didn't disagree.

Here you write, "and yet ..." which implies you disagree. However you haven't explicitly said so, and based on previous posts, it may be that you don't disagree. So rather than my wasting time on the assumption that you disagree with my assertion when maybe you really don't, please let me know where you stand on this. Specifically, do you disagree with the statement that "This revelation was necessary for man, unfallen worlds, and holy angels." ?

To respond to your questions brief:

1.Regarding Enoch et al, God revealed Christ to them.
2.Regarding the angels, they had doubts in regards to Satan's character until the cross, which had an impact on their service to God.

I'll explain in more detail after you respond to my question.

I'm trying to understand why the statement is true. Yes, I believe it, but certain facts are troubling. Since Enoch, Moses, and Elijah went to heaven before Jesus and Satan were unveiled I assume they were eternally secure before these two things happened. So, how can we say the holy angels and unfallen beings were less secure than Enoch, Moses, and Elijah before those two things happened? And if they were secure before Jesus and Satan were unveiled why was it necessary for these two things to happen? Was there more at stake?

There are a couple of different issues involved. One is the Great Controversy, which involves God's being shown to be right in regards to the accusations Satan has made against him. Jesus, of course, was at the forefront in this, but the 144,000 will also have a role. Another issue is the salvation of individual human beings, such as Moses etc.

In order for anyone to be saved, regardless of when they live, some revelation of Jesus Christ is necessary. We are saved when the Holy Spirit makes a direct appeal to our hearts, and we respond to that appeal. This is not dependent upon when one lives, or the revelation of the cross as already having happened as opposed to not yet happening. I wasn't present when Christ died, yet the Holy Spirit was able to present that event to me as if I had been there, in fact, as even better than that because many who were there had no idea what was happening. God is able to do that for any human being, and did so for Moses, etc. They were saved by faith in a living Christ, an ever-present Savior, just the same as those who live after.

Back to your question as to the necessity of the cross. It should be clear to see that the Great Controversy could not have been resolved without the cross. The angels and unfallen worlds were convinced in regards to the respective characters of God and Satan at the cross, and the 144,000 would not be able to do the work they have to do without the cross.

But if knowing about Jesus' revelation of God's character before He died on the cross was sufficient to take Enoch, Moses, and Elijah to heaven, sufficient for them to feel secure and unafraid of God, why did Jesus actually have to die on the cross?

Also, were holy angels and unfallen beings less secure than Enoch, Moses, and Elijah before Jesus actually died on the cross?