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Here is a link to show exactly where the Space Station is over earth right now: Click Here
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9971
09/22/03 07:14 AM
09/22/03 07:14 AM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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quote:
Originally posted by Larry Kirkpatrick:
Darius:
Do you accept as truth our fundamental belief #17 which includes the statement that the writings of Ellen G. White are "an authoritative and continuing source of truth"? From your remakrs above it seems very much that you could not affirm this teaching.
LK
I will answer with this simple remark. A gold mark is a guaranteed source of gold. But I can assure you that not everything that is extracted from that gold mine is gold.
You have obviously changed #17 in your mind so that it reads differently. That is extremely dangerous, especially if you are teaching others to do the same.
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9972
09/22/03 07:17 AM
09/22/03 07:17 AM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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Mike, it is interesting that you continue to sidestep the fact that deception has a particular meaning. In fact, you completely ignore the word deception in your analysis of the story. If your account is true, Eve's behavior could never be classified as the result of deception. That is the objective truth. I think we have adequately gone over the fact that you seem to be using EGW as the interpreter of the Bible instead of the lesser light leading to the greater light. It is clear from your usage that to you she is the greater light.
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9973
09/22/03 05:10 PM
09/22/03 05:10 PM
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Darius,
If I had to choose between Ellen White's interpretation, if I can even use that word, and your interpretation, guess who's I would choose?
As long as EGW doesn't say something that goes against the biblical account, in this case the account written by Moses, then I will choose her's over your's or any otherr person's. Why? Because she was obviously God's chosen messenger, and He obviously revealed to her more detailed information. She couldn't be the lesser light leading us back to the greater light unless she had been given relevant information.
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9974
09/22/03 06:10 PM
09/22/03 06:10 PM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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quote:
Originally posted by Daryl Fawcett:
As long as EGW doesn't say something that goes against the biblical account, in this case the account written by Moses, then I will choose her's over your's or any otherr person's.
The truth is that EGW's dependence on popular ideas about the fall goes against Moses' account when Paul's commentary is given consideration.
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9975
09/22/03 07:42 PM
09/22/03 07:42 PM
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Very well. Let me quote the pertinent portion exactly for you. This may help you to give a clear answer to those who are following the discussion. "As the Lord's messenger her [Ellen White's] writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction."
This is the agreed-upon teaching of the Seventh-day Adventist Church the world over. Again my question to you (in search of a straight answer, not an answer which you might self-declare to be straight) is, do you accept this biblical teaching of the Seventh-day Adventist Church?
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9976
09/23/03 12:46 AM
09/23/03 12:46 AM
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SDA
Charter Member
Active Member 2019
20000+ Member
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 22,256
Southwest USA
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Darius, I am very convinced, with Paul, that Eve was deceived into eating the fruit Moses said God told her not to.
1 Timothy
2:14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9977
09/23/03 12:56 PM
09/23/03 12:56 PM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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quote:
Originally posted by Larry Kirkpatrick:
Very well. Let me quote the pertinent portion exactly for you. This may help you to give a clear answer to those who are following the discussion. "As the Lord's messenger her [Ellen White's] writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth which provide for the church comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction."
My use of EGW's writings are entirely consistent with what is stated here. Take the time to understand the language that was very carefully selected. She provides "comfort, guidance, instruction, and correction." Nothing therein states that she is infallible and cannot be questioned or analysed. You are free to agitate for a change in language, but until you accomplish this you are stuck with this. Your interpretation of this fundamental belief is patently flawed.
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9978
09/23/03 01:15 PM
09/23/03 01:15 PM
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But Darius, what about this part that clearly says that her "writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth"?
But then, if you don't even accept the Bible as the continuing and authoritative source of truth, then how can you accept her writings that way is the question I ask myself here.
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9979
09/23/03 01:21 PM
09/23/03 01:21 PM
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And as far as the Bible reference Mike Lowe gave, even Eve herself said that she was deceived by the serpent:
[quote]
Genesis 3:13 (Darby Version or Translation) And Jehovah Elohim said to the woman, What is this thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent deceived me, and I ate.
The KJV uses the word beguiled which I understand means deceived.
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Re: The truth about the fall
#9980
09/23/03 01:38 PM
09/23/03 01:38 PM
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OP
Dedicated Member
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,163
Muncie, IN
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quote:
Originally posted by Daryl Fawcett:
But Darius, what about this part that clearly says that her "writings are a continuing and authoritative source of truth"?
Why is it so difficult to see that the brethren understood that a source of truth is not identical to "the truth?" The language is unambiguous. Why is so difficult to accept for EGW what Paul accepted for himself? Where is the evidence that the call to prophethood included an elevation to infallibility? We cannot just continue to post citations without applying the divine gift of reason.
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Here is the link to this week's Sabbath School Lesson Study and Discussion Material: Click Here
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